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 Post subject: she breathes again
PostPosted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 4:35 pm 
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Joined: Tue Feb 21, 2012 4:38 pm
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Just rebuilt the Montjuich,new seals,bearings,valve guides,clutch,and new pistal pistons,didn,t really need the pistons as the old ones were in good condition after 18500 km,s,but just to be safe. Fitted a set of wheels from a monster to get 17 inch tyres,took her up the road and I now remember why I loved these bikes so many years ago. It,s quick,handles,stops and makes such a beautifull sound,i wish I was 20 years younger!! I also think the frame on these models handle better and feel more planted than the tt2 Verlicchi type,i think the extra engine mount below the footpegs make the whole structure feel more solid. But now I need more power from my 600 TT2 to keep up with the jap 4 cyl 1000,s. Waiting and searching for a donor engine of 750cc,which I would prefer is like looking for a needle in a haystack,even though I have 2 correct heads for a 500 pantah.Could I fit these heads to a later 750 motor or a paso if I can locate one? Or I,m thinking of going the 900 route with a redfox reversed head,but will the taller engine fit the tt2 frame? There seems to be a few 900 engines available for reasonable money.Any one know of problems with this type of conversion? Any info appreciated.


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 Post subject: Re: she breathes again
PostPosted: Fri Sep 19, 2014 5:31 pm 
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Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2010 12:20 pm
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Location: Vermont, USA
Nice set up! That really looks like a fun ride.
Bill


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 Post subject: Re: she breathes again
PostPosted: Tue Sep 23, 2014 10:52 pm 
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Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2010 10:32 pm
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ian charlton wrote:
Or I,m thinking of going the 900 route with a redfox reversed head,but will the taller engine fit the tt2 frame? There seems to be a few 900 engines available for reasonable money.Any one know of problems with this type of conversion? Any info appreciated.


Nice F1, I have similar Laguna Seca that needs some love at the moment.

You are right any early Pantah is hard to get hold of and $$$$ these days compared to later 900 motor. I picked up later 900SS motor for $100, F3 Pantah frame for $300 and have been doing the conversion.

It is not crazy difficult the engine mounting points are the same between 900ss and F3 400cc engine. The 900 motor is taller so the rear head is a little tall, so I had to cut and plate the top shock mount frame tubes, there are two of them with heaps of bracing so nothing is especially weakened. To clear the swing arm I chopped the whole back off the F3and made the back end a similar shape to the TT2. Also that meant I could narrow the top frame tubes so TT2 bodywork fits.

Next mission is I am making some custom carb inlets which places FCR Keihin above the front head which allows F1 tank to almost fit.


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 Post subject: Re: she breathes again
PostPosted: Wed Sep 24, 2014 5:37 pm 
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Yes, it,s fairly easy to pick up the 900 motors,and they are strong and can be made to perform well with reliability. The frame I am intending to use is my original tt2 verlicchi from 83,and I was hoping the 900 would fit with the reversed head and a little shaving of the engine,shoehorn it in.But without having a 900 engine at hand,i,m still at the guessing stage. It,s tight at 600 with 58 stroke.


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 Post subject: Re: she breathes again
PostPosted: Wed Sep 24, 2014 6:44 pm 
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ian charlton wrote:
Yes, it,s fairly easy to pick up the 900 motors,and they are strong and can be made to perform well with reliability. The frame I am intending to use is my original tt2 verlicchi from 83,and I was hoping the 900 would fit with the reversed head and a little shaving of the engine,shoehorn it in.But without having a 900 engine at hand,i,m still at the guessing stage. It,s tight at 600 with 58 stroke.


Not sure about the TT2 but the top of the rear head would need the fins ground off and would probably still be tight. Two Wheeled Classics frame fits 900 but not sure what they do to the top shock tube.
http://www.twowheelclassics.co.uk/catal ... Frame.html


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 Post subject: Re: she breathes again
PostPosted: Thu Sep 25, 2014 1:03 am 
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Hello Ian

The 900 is bigger (a hunk) than it looks: Cylinders are 11-12mm taller/longer (big conflict with V cylinder cam cog); the center of the engine is about 1/2 inch deeper; engine-to-frame bolt bosses are 1/8th inch longer on one side; swingarm pin is 20mm, and the engine is 7/8th inch wider there; the 900 swingarm is much wider at the pegs/muffler hangers; and the fins on the V cylinder will likely have to be cut back. Finally, it probably weighs 20-25 lbs more. A lot of hacking to a 1983 frame (a shame) would be needed.

I have a frame designed for the 900 engine, and almost panicked when I had reason to remove the V cam cog recently---for an instant I was envisioning all the things needed to drop the engine---but it wiggled out. Whew!

Below are photos of the frame with both an 800 (2013) and a 900 (2014) engine in it.

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MikeV


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 Post subject: Re: she breathes again
PostPosted: Thu Sep 25, 2014 2:38 am 
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618f1,i thank you for your reply,that sums up the job nicely.I had expected these problems and did not want to do the cut and shut mods on the frame as it is indeed an original,i,d rather mod the motor.I,m thinking I need to stick with original plan and hope a 750 motor turns up,i,ve just missed an Allazurra which sold within hours of being advertised,maybe more tt reps being born.


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 Post subject: Re: she breathes again
PostPosted: Thu Sep 25, 2014 4:18 am 
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Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2012 12:33 pm
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Paso motor fits just fine Ian,


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 Post subject: Re: she breathes again
PostPosted: Thu Sep 25, 2014 10:15 am 
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Posts: 124
yes auburn,that,s what I need. With the capacity brought up with 90mm pistons and the reversed heads,that would be perfect.I have a pair of heads from a 500,1981,which I could maybe have modified to use. Do these heads go ok with the paso motor,nice bike you have there.


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 Post subject: Re: she breathes again
PostPosted: Thu Sep 25, 2014 10:44 am 
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Ian. The 500 heads can be made to "work" with help from an experienced machinist. As stock they have only 90mm wide combustion chambers, whereas the 750 cylinders are 95mm wide at the top, so they will have to be widened to even plop them on. Then, of course, you will need serious work to the heads for bigger chambers, spark plug relocation, larger valve, and porting to make them go! That is where help from Steve Munro and JR Precision might be good.

Please remember that the Paso motor needs modifications to the swingarm area; several in the group have posted articles and photo here in the past. And, any 500-650 engine will need to have the spigots opened to 96mm+ for they lower part of the 750 cylinders to slip in.

MikeV


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