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 Post subject: Re: M16? Coming soon... HERE!!
PostPosted: Tue Apr 22, 2014 12:00 pm 
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Posts: 124
Well done,nice bike,nice purchase,look after her and enjoy.Mine is not so bonny as it is soon to be used in the classic tt,but it can be made bonny again! These Montjuich,s are so lovely.


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 Post subject: Re: M16? Coming soon... HERE!!
PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 4:24 am 
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Posts: 98
Location: Sunshine Coast, Australia
Well done!

My Japanese mate had a standing order with a manager friend at Red Baron in Japan.

If a Montjuic came up with a number less than 50 to notify him. He now owns number 45 i think it is....

He said the guys at Murayama Japan said the first 50 had engines were put together by NCR and after that they were assembled in the Ducati factory.

Can anyone back this legend?

Sean


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 Post subject: Re: M16? Coming soon... HERE!!
PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 8:57 am 
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It would be good to know if that was indeed a fact,doesn,t really change much,but still nice to know for sure.Someone will have the answer I,m sure,perhaps Pat or Roy T might know.


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 Post subject: Re: M16? Coming soon... HERE!!
PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 1:43 pm 
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if you want, I could ask it to my friend Rino Caracchi. (NCR)

;)


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 Post subject: Re: M16? Coming soon... HERE!!
PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 2:13 pm 
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That would be good Carlo,i have 117,and a friend I think has no 4.BUT ,I do not have the tank number with mine,i,ve never had it. Doesn,t slow her down any though :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: M16? Coming soon... HERE!!
PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 7:49 pm 
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customheadf1750 wrote:
He said the guys at Murayama Japan said the first 50 had engines were put together by NCR and after that they were assembled in the Ducati factory.
Can anyone back this legend?

Unless Rino Carrachi begs to differ, this legend is a furphy. Below is Ian Falloon's response to the query I put to him.

Hi Mike

The Montjuichs didn't have NCR engines. I don't know where that came from. I was actually at the factory in 86 when they were assembling them and I went to NCR also. NCR was only a tiny shop making a few uninteresting Pantah specials at that time. No race bikes at all. I was quite surprised, and disappointed really. The special bikes were the factory TT1 racers and I saw them all, and where they were being built, and it certainly wasn't at NCR.


The Frasers bike was definitely a pre-production example as it was made before the ones I saw at the factory. Seems to be very much a modified F1. To tell you the truth they were all modified F1s as they were making them concurrently, and sharing a lot of parts. They were not specially assembled so forget myths and legends. I guess I was lucky to visit the factory many times when all this was happening.

Regards

Ian

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 Post subject: Re: M16? Coming soon... HERE!!
PostPosted: Thu Apr 24, 2014 4:29 am 
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Posts: 173
I respect Ian for his expertise on bikes, and am always interested in what he has to say in his books.
But i beg to differ in this case.
Italy was FULL of tiny shops in the 80's, making uninteresting Pantah specials, such as NCR,Moretti and GPM.
It still IS full of those tiny shops, where people try to live their dreams and do it THEIR way.
We all know at least one close to Firenze, don't we ?
It's just a pity that one quote like this could give a whole false turn to the credits of someone.
Some of us were already into the Ducati scene in 1972 when Mr. S made his dream debut at Imola.
But it wasn't really WORLD news at that time (except for a small minority).
What if Mr. H didn't see one of the Ducati racers (which were FastByNCR).
They weren't perfect (Mr. W had to make some mods to make it IoM-fast) but they could run with the rest of the world.
In 1978, THAT was worldnews, and i'm sure NCR did have a return-on-investment at this occasion.

I'm aware that there is some truth in Ian's saying that the real interesting bikes were at Ducati.
The scene had changed with the coming of i Fratelli Castiglioni and more money was involved.
I'm not sure anyone at NCR could've persuaded Mr. Roberts to test one of their bikes.
So they worked on the more private bikes. Stefano Caracchi Daytona anyone ?
NCR wasn't the sort of shop to do big runs of engines or bikes. Just small orders.
Raceprepping 50 engines isn't something You do in a small shop while a few kilometers away, 50 bikes are waiting for them.
Building engines to Ducati-standards was done in the factory.

ciao
beppi

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 Post subject: Re: M16? Coming soon... HERE!!
PostPosted: Thu Apr 24, 2014 7:10 am 
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?


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 Post subject: Re: M16? Coming soon... HERE!!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2014 11:24 am 
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I do not want to get into a boring discussion , I have made ​​my own idea of how they have gone in the years since the events you mentioned.

In Italy, the facts are most of the time , very very simple .

The NCR has built many bikes tt1 , and the great mechanic George Nepoti , when he had to make a drawing and build an engine block for a pilot , he was not watching where he was a pilot titled or a great champion, he put his wisdom , and so much passion in the work he was doing , but because they could not do a minor thing , he knew just the right thing to do .

Moretti, GPM .... NCR ..... are all craftsmen who have made their passion their work.

Let's explore what it takes to make a good tt1 ...... Cam P. .. pistons ... good ... good frame and a good drill to relieve all internal components .... then everything is in the right wrist the pilot and the magic of the mechanical tuner .

Now there are incredible materials , electronics that helps a lot and makes a difference.

This is my humble opinion . Sorry , but I can not capture every nuance of your speeches, I do not speak English, and the translator does what he can .

Greetings from Italy . Carlo Leoncini .


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 Post subject: Re: M16? Coming soon... HERE!!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2014 8:24 pm 
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Thanks for the interesting comments - Beppi and Carlo ;)

The question still remains... Did Ducati outsource the assembly of the first 50 Montjuich engines to NCR? :?: :?:

Carlo, can you ask your friend Rino if he can answer this question?

Cheers,
Mike

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